Between: “17.8”

[this first section was written while I was doing March’s K6BD, a month before the rest of this post]

Well then. My dreams got hilariously meta tonight. Let’s see if I can get this straight:

First I dreamt that I got a bound book version of Worm. Then in the dream I read the next chapter ahead of blogging it because I wanted to experience reading it in the book, deciding to try a new approach where I read first and blogged later.

(I seemed to only think of this halfway through the chapter. Like, “oh wait I’m supposed to blog this, okay let’s call it a new approach I’m experimenting with”.)

Then when I started actually blogging (on my phone, a part of the new approach that I’ve actually considered because the mobile WordPress editor has gotten better), I couldn’t find my way back to the right page in the book.

Instead I found a ton of fake chapter titles in the ToC (that should have been my first big clue it wasn’t real, what with Worm not actually having chapter titles), and an interlude (named something else, something overly technical, and distinct from the actual Interludes in Worm) in the middle of the book that was elaborately illustrated with beautiful drawings of a bunch of Amethyst chickens.

I didn’t read the text there because it was ahead of the page I was looking for; the whole time I was interacting with the book I was being really careful about spoilers.

Then I “woke up” and tried again at my kitchen table, finding more ToCs with a new set of fake titles. It was roughly organized by Arc, but scrambled within each.

I realized I was still dreaming and successfully changed the color of someone’s shirt before waking up to the next level, which involved a dream manipulator showing me his Minecraft mansion or something. This part is the fuzziest for me now.

Then I woke up and got to watch a YouTube video we’d apparently been making, showing how he’d been manipulating my dreams by talking to me while I was sleeping in a chair. It covered the origin of each major element of the deeper dreams, from the ToC chapter titles to the Amethyst chickens to the mansion (which unfortunately for him got swallowed up by the sea in a manner much like the Lunar Sea Spire from SU). In the video I looked more like Jack Douglass than myself.

I remember looking to the Worm book after watching the video, pointing out to someone that I couldn’t even open the book because of the spoiler risks.

Then I woke up for real, laughing my ass off at how meta it had all been.

Before we get started on the K6BD patron comments and asks, it has come to my attention that today, April 10th, is a certain someone’s birthday. Happy birthday, Wildbow!

K6BD patron comments

1. “Fish Allison” on 9-102 is a rare callback to the forum comic, from the “cycle through infinite Allison” seizure GIF. Extracted frame:


Ooh, yeah, this does ring a bell now that I’m seeing it.

2. 001’s repeated “this is a peaceful land” routine & references to “kind inhabitants” seems to be referencing a Dark Souls character — here’s a 39-second meme video that should get the point across:

Pffft. Kind inhabitants indeed.

3. I don’t think “cycle” has been used as a measure of time previously; you might be thinking of “turns” which are roughly equivalent to days. White Chain did comment “that sounds like a cycle” in book 2 in response to Juggernaut Star’s plan so make of that what you will.

Oh, huh. Yeah, I think I was thinking of turns, and maybe mixing that up with something else using cycles for years.

4. I saved this since I thought you might find it amusing:


[Reddit comments for page 9-116]

Imagine some girl busts into your dimension threatens to kill your living god. Only to have another girl come in, nearly kill the first girl and then they start making out.

“Again? It’s not even Wednesday.”

The Emissary had quite the day. 😛

This is one of those points where you can see the legacy of Homestuck in K6BD, even if it’s not doing a straight (or gay, in this case) reference.

5. Since you noticed something along these lines — the pages with the white borders are ones where changes made for the print edition were back-ported into the comic. For example, the kiss page used to have a pink background ( Most of the changes are not too interesting but here’s 001’s original combat outfit which was deemed to be a bit excessive:

Ohh, that makes sense.

I definitely agree with both of those changes, too. “Avert thine ailing eyes” indeed. Turns out Mammon’s mortal weakness is nosebleeds.

6. The “Siege of Yre” spread took about 5 weeks so during the hiatus there was some fanart put up that was later unlinked but the files are still on the server. There are a couple in particular I thought you would like:



– by int16

Ooh, this is nice. Casual chill times with the squad (and Oscar).

I like the fact that Ys-Voya gets a cameo in a fanwork. Seems fitting to pay her tribute in a piece of audience participation.

Also… Alyisun. Family of Yisun. I don’t think I’d ever piece that together on my own without being prompted or finding some reason to try to combine the names as a joke.


— can’t find credit for this one

[If someone knows who made this, please tell me so I can edit in attribution.]

I’m really liking these casual portrayals of K6BD characters. Very calming images.

Cat Master plays Neko Atsume while his cats are sleeping. This is a fact.

7. It is my sincere belief that Oscar had the “Bad Man” captain hat made in advance of the heist and was carrying it with him the entire time.

I really love that interpretation because that means either he was fully expecting to end up commandeering a ship, or he constantly carries around a wardrobe’s worth of “bad man” apparel for any given situation that might warrant it. Now that’s how you use hammerspace.

8. It’s a little unclear what’s going on with Mammon at the end although he does seem to be a bit on fire before the cut to black. Do you think he’s still alive? Do you think we’re going to see any demiurge deaths at all or is Allison going to screw prophecy and go for the friendship ending?

I think he’s okay. He’s grown old and frail, but he still seems to be really tough. I don’t think the fire is likely to hurt him much.

I think it’s possible that one or two might die, but it seems more likely that Allison will “take them down” in ways that aren’t necessarily as straightforward as death. More custom-tailored defeats, if you will. Above all else, what we’ve seen her do so far is destroy the status quo for each of them — removing Mottom’s gluttonous source of immortality, indirectly causing the destruction of Mammon’s vault (via Mottom), starting the war Mottom was hoping to prevent. She’s not breaking them, she’s breaking their thrones, and that can often be so much more interesting in the long run than simply killing them off.

If “one or two” or however many do die, it might not even be by Allison’s hand. More likely, her shenanigans cause the Demiurges to turn on each other, while reducing some to the point where others clean up what’s left.

9. When you looked at the Aesma story, you mentioned some parallels between Aesma’s encounter with the second master & Allison’s adventures with Mottom in book 2, and you wondered if there would be further parallels. I would just like to mention that Aesma’s encounter with the first master involved a huge friendly lad and the collapse of a large tower. So that’s a thing I guess. Allison’s mixed up the order a bit but she’s at least got the spirit.

Oooh, yeah, that’s a good point. I guess I should be looking out for– oh yeah Solomon really exudes the vibe of the third master, doesn’t he…

10. Based on the cover of the next book, any further predictions on what Salami Dave will be like, or how Allison will get involved with him?

Between his name, his brief previous appearance and his continued smugness in the cover, he’s pretty obviously tied to the Sin of Pride, while also presenting himself as a wise philosopher type. So I think he’s probably not as wise and above it all as he thinks he is (again tying back to the third master), and Allison might give him and his followers a rude awakening on that front.

As for how she’ll get involved with him… The cover appears to be set in the Void, which is interesting considering the cast just came back from it a little while back. I’m not sure how relevant that is. Other than that I don’t feel there’s much to go on, though, unlike last time where we already knew the next stop was in the vault that was shown on the cover.

For now, we know Zaid was sold, but to whom? Where did they go? It’s possible that he somehow ended up being passed along to Solomon, continuing his streak of Princess Peaching Allison along through the Demiurges’ castles.

Also, Allison should avoid dogs for a little while.

11. Regarding not enough of Yre being seen — general agreement although I want to point out that there was a span of several hours that was reduced to a one-page montage. So presumably there was a lot more that we didn’t see. I think it’s a consequence of the format and the roughly two page per week update schedule — everything has to be kept pretty tight or else the comic will never end.

Yeah, that’s a fair point. Webcomic time can be brutal.

And one other thing I wanted to mention after doing some re-reading … you said you were having trouble remembering the name “Mathangi ten Meti” which is understandable but she referred to herself as Maya several times so perhaps that would be easier to remember. Maya is a real-world abbreviation / nickname for Mathangi so that’s one mystery solved. As for the significance of the rest of the name it’s addressed in some of the bonus texts but you’ll probably figure it out on your own eventually.

Ah, right! Yeah, thinking of her as Maya might help.

I’ll get the full name into my noggin eventually, I’m sure.


I heard there’s COVID-19 in your country now. Have you considered the possibility that it arrived with your new laptop battery? You fell ill after the battery arrived, didn’t you? You might have recovered swiftly due to your youth without realizing what you had. But now the genie is out of the bag and the cat is out of pandora’s box. All because of a battery.


I’m sure you’re joking, but nah. I fell ill just before the battery arrived, and my municipality apparently still only has one known case of COVID. Plus, just tonight my dad went and tested negative.

My parents did however find a document that said I’d had a coronavirus early last year… (it was of course one of the classic ones, just a regular cold)

Sharks: There’s some stuff about Vestige that I’m blocking for spoiler reasons, but long story short, I don’t think you should hear the WoG mentioned before.

The verdict is in!

Capes in 2020 be like “I can’t come to work, I have corona pollentia”

Pfft, nice.

Krixwell, you’ve been on arc 17 since September. The April Fools joke was more painful than anything.

Man, I miss the days when I went through an Arc a month just as much as you do.

Kind of off-topic but you’re really wise so I want to know what you think — I get really frustrated when people claim that SBaHJ memes are a subset of Homestuck memes, because SBaHJ started a month before Homestuck. Who do you side with?

I’m wise? I find that a highly questionable allegation. 😛

This is a question where the answer has no right to be as complicated as it is. The thing is, SBaHJ memes are SBaHJ memes, but SBaHJ memes and memes about SBaHJ memes are a thing within Homestuck that can itself be memed about. Which means that there are Homestuck memes about SBaHJ and about SBaHJ memes and they’re a slightly different thing from plain SBaHJ memes.

Additionally, the nature of MS Paint Adventures means Homestuck memes as a whole can’t be fully understood in a bubble of merely Homestuck. So many things in Homestuck are themselves memetic references back to the previous MSPA works, or even Andrew’s pre-MSPA works. SBaHJ is not officially an MS Paint Adventure, but by virtue of its inclusion in Homestuck, it has honorary status as part of MSPA and was hosted on the MSPA site (and now on the Homestuck site). As such, we need to compare SBaHJ memes to Problem Sleuth memes. To Bard Quest memes. Even to Jailbreak memes.

Homestuck makes references to all of them, and in using these memes it subsumes them, digests them. Homestuck eats these memes and spits them back out as Homestuck Things, which subsequently become Homestuck memes.

What pumpkin? You are quite certain this is a Jailbreak meme, but by its inclusion in Homestuck, it takes new form as a Homestuck meme, used liberally even by those who don’t even know what Jailbreak is. When someone knows a thing only from Homestuck, yet Homestuck’s use of it was itself a reference to a previous work, which is it a meme from?

In answering whether Jailbreak, Bard Quest, Problem Sleuth memes are Homestuck memes, we have to ask ourselves real questions about what a meme even is, and at which point a memetic reference becomes a part of a work that can be memetically referenced in its own right instead of simply a further copy, mimema, of an existing meme.

With SBaHJ, it gets even more complicated, because while the first few comics of SBaHJ was created some time before Homestuck and had nothing to do with the upcoming project at the time, Homestuck seems to have adopted SBaHJ entirely into itself, as comic-within-a-comic side content. It’s unclear whether or not SBaHJ even counts as its own separate thing anymore (especially after further SBaHJ content was made during Homestuck’s run and references went both ways), and if SBaHJ is retroactively part of Homestuck, then surely memes from it are from Homestuck?

But does that logic apply if the meme specifically refers to those first few comics that were made and published before Homestuck, as a direct response to and parody of someone else’s work on a forum thread?

Ultimately, it’s a really messy staircase of questions, and if we start falling down them despite thorough warnings, it’s going to keep happening. How high do you even have to be to think this hard about something so trivial? All we can do is sit back, enjoy a picture of some falling nanchos while flipping our best friends’ mothers turnways and watching the big man play on the burning coart as the sports pile fails to stop from getting taller, and ask one last question:

Remember Longcat, Jane?



by Gary_the_Kid

Pfft. Yep, gotta support poor kids like Shadow Stalker through these trying times.


by Kingdaume

Kingdaume is back at it again with excellent art of best girl! Gotta love that vulpine smile, and the hint of lavender extending past the costume into every part of the image is very nice.

(Also only now do I realize that the e at the end of the name Kingdaume is probably silent and the name a play off “kingdom”.)

Hey, so, while we’re on the topic of fanart…

Sprite-0001 Skitter

I did a thing.